+/- character (±) in strings

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+/- character (±) in strings

Maguin, Eugene

Probably time to learn something new ….

I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the ‘±’ character to separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and pasted it into the concantenation. For instance,

Compute M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)’ ±’,string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6. The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is 30±1. So, it could be that inserting that ‘±’ makes that concantenation longer than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what’s the true story?

Thanks, Gene Maguin

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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Bruce Weaver
Administrator
Hi Gene.  I'm curious about why you want to report mean & SD that way.  I
know it is commonly done in some fields. But I also know that some authors
strongly recommend not using the +/- sign to report the SD.  E.g., see the
first paragraph of the Presentation section on p. 47 of this article:

https://smw.ch/resource/jf/journal/file/view/article/smw/en/smw.2007.11587/smw.2007.11587.pdf/

Cheers,
Bruce



Maguin, Eugene wrote

> Probably time to learn something new ....
> I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and
> concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the '±' character to
> separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and
> pasted it into the concantenation. For instance,
> Compute M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)' ±',string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6.
> The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is 30±1.
> So, it could be that inserting that '±' makes that concantenation longer
> than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what's the true story?
> Thanks, Gene Maguin
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
> INFO REFCARD





-----
--
Bruce Weaver
[hidden email]
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"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.

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=====================
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Bruce Weaver
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NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Jon Peck
In reply to this post by Maguin, Eugene
Assuming that you are in Unicode mode, the +/- character takes two bytes (hex code C2B1).  In code page mode, it would only take 1 (hex B1).  Unicode gives you many more choices of symbols, but they may take 2 or 3 bytes, and the string width in Statistics is measured in bytes, not characters.

p.s.  I am not convinced about deprecating the +/- usage by the article Bruce cites.

On Thu, Mar 22, 2018 at 1:25 PM, Maguin, Eugene <[hidden email]> wrote:

Probably time to learn something new ….

I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the ‘±’ character to separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and pasted it into the concantenation. For instance,

Compute M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)’ ±’,string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6. The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is 30±1. So, it could be that inserting that ‘±’ makes that concantenation longer than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what’s the true story?

Thanks, Gene Maguin

===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD



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Jon K Peck
[hidden email]

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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Rich Ulrich
In reply to this post by Bruce Weaver

Bruce,

I want to mention other shortcomings of the article you cite.

Yes, I've been confused with +/-   when it was not documented;

all I would say about that is, "Always document it."


Randomized vs Observational - is a MAJOR difference, worth more discussion.

"Multivariate methods" have distinct limits in trying to correct

for non-comparable samples (mentioned, but not enough).


Hierarchical arrangement of hypotheses does much to wipe out the

problem of "too many tests" (not mentioned).

Creating sensible composite scores does much more

to wipe out "too many tests" (not mentioned).


Skewness is mentioned ("need for using medians," etc.), but nothing

about outliers or the sensible use of transformations when needed, or

why the rank-transformation is not particularly desirable.  Rank tests

for two variables are useful for confirming that "the other result is robust."


Mis-statement about the "< 5 in a cell rule" and consequences. (Some less

that 5 might not matter; the only BAD consequence is an inflated test X2 value,

owing to division with tiny denominator.  Not-significant is not a problem.)


Cherry-picking of alternate forms of tests is a problem, not mentioned.


--

Rich Ulrich



From: SPSSX(r) Discussion <[hidden email]> on behalf of Bruce Weaver <[hidden email]>
Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2018 5:31:53 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: +/- character (±) in strings
 
Hi Gene.  I'm curious about why you want to report mean & SD that way.  I
know it is commonly done in some fields. But I also know that some authors
strongly recommend not using the +/- sign to report the SD.  E.g., see the
first paragraph of the Presentation section on p. 47 of this article:

https://smw.ch/resource/jf/journal/file/view/article/smw/en/smw.2007.11587/smw.2007.11587.pdf/

Cheers,
Bruce



Maguin, Eugene wrote
> Probably time to learn something new ....
> I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and
> concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the '±' character to
> separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and
> pasted it into the concantenation. For instance,
> Compute M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)' ±',string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6.
> The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is 30±1.
> So, it could be that inserting that '±' makes that concantenation longer
> than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what's the true story?
> Thanks, Gene Maguin
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
> INFO REFCARD





-----
--
Bruce Weaver
[hidden email]
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.

--
Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
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===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Bruce Weaver
Administrator
Fair points, Rich.  It was not my intention to endorse everything in that
article.  I was actually looking for another article that recommends not
using Mean +/- SD, but still cannot find it.  This book by Lang & Secic also
advises against Mean +/- SD:  

https://books.google.ca/books/about/How_to_Report_Statistics_in_Medicine.html?id=kBUBRh1AWG4C&redir_esc=y

Search for <standard deviation> inside the book, click on p. 11, and see
section 1.10 at the bottom of the page.  

I think we all agree that the bigger problem is failing to document properly
what is being reported, not using point estimate +/- something.  But I still
prefer Mean (SD).  ;-)  



Rich Ulrich wrote

> Bruce,
>
> I want to mention other shortcomings of the article you cite.
>
> Yes, I've been confused with +/-   when it was not documented;
>
> all I would say about that is, "Always document it."
>
>
> Randomized vs Observational - is a MAJOR difference, worth more
> discussion.
>
> "Multivariate methods" have distinct limits in trying to correct
>
> for non-comparable samples (mentioned, but not enough).
>
>
> Hierarchical arrangement of hypotheses does much to wipe out the
>
> problem of "too many tests" (not mentioned).
>
> Creating sensible composite scores does much more
>
> to wipe out "too many tests" (not mentioned).
>
>
> Skewness is mentioned ("need for using medians," etc.), but nothing
>
> about outliers or the sensible use of transformations when needed, or
>
> why the rank-transformation is not particularly desirable.  Rank tests
>
> for two variables are useful for confirming that "the other result is
> robust."
>
>
> Mis-statement about the "< 5 in a cell rule" and consequences. (Some less
>
> that 5 might not matter; the only BAD consequence is an inflated test X2
> value,
>
> owing to division with tiny denominator.  Not-significant is not a
> problem.)
>
>
> Cherry-picking of alternate forms of tests is a problem, not mentioned.
>
>
> --
>
> Rich Ulrich
>
>
> ________________________________
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion &lt;

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> &gt; on behalf of Bruce Weaver &lt;

> bruce.weaver@

> &gt;
> Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2018 5:31:53 PM
> To:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> Subject: Re: +/- character (±) in strings
>
> Hi Gene.  I'm curious about why you want to report mean & SD that way.  I
> know it is commonly done in some fields. But I also know that some authors
> strongly recommend not using the +/- sign to report the SD.  E.g., see the
> first paragraph of the Presentation section on p. 47 of this article:
>
> https://smw.ch/resource/jf/journal/file/view/article/smw/en/smw.2007.11587/smw.2007.11587.pdf/
>
> Cheers,
> Bruce
>
>
>
> Maguin, Eugene wrote
>> Probably time to learn something new ....
>> I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and
>> concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the '±' character to
>> separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and
>> pasted it into the concantenation. For instance,
>> Compute M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)' ±',string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6.
>> The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is
>> 30±1.
>> So, it could be that inserting that '±' makes that concantenation longer
>> than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what's the true story?
>> Thanks, Gene Maguin
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> LISTSERV@.UGA
>
>>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
>> command. To leave the list, send the command
>> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
>> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
>> INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> --
> Bruce Weaver

> bweaver@

> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>
> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>
> --
> Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
> INFO REFCARD
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
> INFO REFCARD





-----
--
Bruce Weaver
[hidden email]
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.

--
Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD
--
Bruce Weaver
bweaver@lakeheadu.ca
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Art Kendall
In reply to this post by Bruce Weaver
 do not have the APA style manual handy but many of its recommendations are
based on research into readability and communication.

A question I would raise is "Who is the audience?"

The more diverse the audience wrt  regional culture, disciplinary culture,
educational level, etc.
The +/-,  or link to a Wikipedia article, or "SD means how spread out the
values are from the mean" become more necessary.

Rich says "document it." YES! In my experience, engineers are very familiar
with "root-mean-square", but not "SD". So some clarification is very
helpful.

It is crucial to try to anticipate possible misinterpret ideas, so for some
audiences it may be necessary to clarify the distinction from SE, margin of
error.
*
Know your audiences and err of the side of too much clarification.*




-----
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
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Art Kendall
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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Bruce Weaver
Administrator
In reply to this post by Maguin, Eugene
I'm sorry, Gene.  My question about why you want to use Mean +/- SD notation
may have distracted everyone from the original question.  So this is an
effort to get things back on track.  

My first thought was that you might be able to use the PIB format.  I know
there are some examples in the archives of this list, but do not know if any
of them will be directly helpful to you.  I have a feeling there could be
problems due to the code for +/- (177) being in the Extended ASCII set.  

https://www.petefreitag.com/cheatsheets/ascii-codes/

David?  Andy?  Jon?  Any ideas?  



Maguin, Eugene wrote

> Probably time to learn something new ....
> I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and
> concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the '±' character to
> separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and
> pasted it into the concantenation. For instance,
> Compute M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)' ±',string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6.
> The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is 30±1.
> So, it could be that inserting that '±' makes that concantenation longer
> than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what's the true story?
> Thanks, Gene Maguin
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
> INFO REFCARD





-----
--
Bruce Weaver
[hidden email]
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.

--
Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD
--
Bruce Weaver
bweaver@lakeheadu.ca
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Maguin, Eugene
Wow!!
I was making a table for another person and myself to look at and I wanted it to fit on a standard page in landscape. I had 11 data columns and two marginal columns to show and I wanted to show SD as well to communicate spread, so I needed to be compact. I'd do it differently for an article and make sure the meaning is described.

Jon, thank you. I figured that could be the problem but wasn't sure.
Gene Maguin

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of Bruce Weaver
Sent: Friday, March 23, 2018 10:17 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: +/- character (±) in strings

I'm sorry, Gene.  My question about why you want to use Mean +/- SD notation may have distracted everyone from the original question.  So this is an effort to get things back on track.  

My first thought was that you might be able to use the PIB format.  I know there are some examples in the archives of this list, but do not know if any of them will be directly helpful to you.  I have a feeling there could be problems due to the code for +/- (177) being in the Extended ASCII set.  

https://www.petefreitag.com/cheatsheets/ascii-codes/

David?  Andy?  Jon?  Any ideas?  



Maguin, Eugene wrote

> Probably time to learn something new ....
> I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and
> concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the '±' character to
> separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and
> pasted it into the concantenation. For instance, Compute
> M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)' ±',string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6.
> The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is 30±1.
> So, it could be that inserting that '±' makes that concantenation
> longer than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what's the true story?
> Thanks, Gene Maguin
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD





-----
--
Bruce Weaver
[hidden email]
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.

--
Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Bruce Weaver
Administrator
Ah, right.  Jon did "stay on track" in his post.  Sorry for suggesting
otherwise, Jon.

http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/character-in-strings-tp5735749p5735752.html



Maguin, Eugene wrote

> Wow!!
> I was making a table for another person and myself to look at and I wanted
> it to fit on a standard page in landscape. I had 11 data columns and two
> marginal columns to show and I wanted to show SD as well to communicate
> spread, so I needed to be compact. I'd do it differently for an article
> and make sure the meaning is described.
>
> Jon, thank you. I figured that could be the problem but wasn't sure.
> Gene Maguin
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion &lt;

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> &gt; On Behalf Of Bruce Weaver
> Sent: Friday, March 23, 2018 10:17 AM
> To:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> Subject: Re: +/- character (±) in strings
>
> I'm sorry, Gene.  My question about why you want to use Mean +/- SD
> notation may have distracted everyone from the original question.  So this
> is an effort to get things back on track.  
>
> My first thought was that you might be able to use the PIB format.  I know
> there are some examples in the archives of this list, but do not know if
> any of them will be directly helpful to you.  I have a feeling there could
> be problems due to the code for +/- (177) being in the Extended ASCII set.  
>
> https://www.petefreitag.com/cheatsheets/ascii-codes/
>
> David?  Andy?  Jon?  Any ideas?  
>
>
>
> Maguin, Eugene wrote
>> Probably time to learn something new ....
>> I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and
>> concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the '±' character to
>> separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and
>> pasted it into the concantenation. For instance, Compute
>> M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)' ±',string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6.
>> The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is
>> 30±1.
>> So, it could be that inserting that '±' makes that concantenation
>> longer than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what's the true
>> story?
>> Thanks, Gene Maguin
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> LISTSERV@.UGA
>
>>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> --
> Bruce Weaver

> bweaver@

> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>
> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>
> --
> Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage
> subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
> INFO REFCARD





-----
--
Bruce Weaver
[hidden email]
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.

--
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--
Bruce Weaver
bweaver@lakeheadu.ca
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

David Marso
Administrator
In reply to this post by Maguin, Eugene
Does simply making the string larger than 6 (say 10 characters) solve the
problem?


Maguin, Eugene wrote

> Wow!!
> I was making a table for another person and myself to look at and I wanted
> it to fit on a standard page in landscape. I had 11 data columns and two
> marginal columns to show and I wanted to show SD as well to communicate
> spread, so I needed to be compact. I'd do it differently for an article
> and make sure the meaning is described.
>
> Jon, thank you. I figured that could be the problem but wasn't sure.
> Gene Maguin
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion &lt;

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> &gt; On Behalf Of Bruce Weaver
> Sent: Friday, March 23, 2018 10:17 AM
> To:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> Subject: Re: +/- character (±) in strings
>
> I'm sorry, Gene.  My question about why you want to use Mean +/- SD
> notation may have distracted everyone from the original question.  So this
> is an effort to get things back on track.  
>
> My first thought was that you might be able to use the PIB format.  I know
> there are some examples in the archives of this list, but do not know if
> any of them will be directly helpful to you.  I have a feeling there could
> be problems due to the code for +/- (177) being in the Extended ASCII set.  
>
> https://www.petefreitag.com/cheatsheets/ascii-codes/
>
> David?  Andy?  Jon?  Any ideas?  
>
>
>
> Maguin, Eugene wrote
>> Probably time to learn something new ....
>> I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and
>> concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the '±' character to
>> separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and
>> pasted it into the concantenation. For instance, Compute
>> M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)' ±',string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6.
>> The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is
>> 30±1.
>> So, it could be that inserting that '±' makes that concantenation
>> longer than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what's the true
>> story?
>> Thanks, Gene Maguin
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> LISTSERV@.UGA
>
>>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> --
> Bruce Weaver

> bweaver@

> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>
> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>
> --
> Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage
> subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
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> INFO REFCARD





-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email me.
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Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email me.
---
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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Art Kendall
In reply to this post by Maguin, Eugene
since it a one-off
Is legal paper available?
Fewer decimals in the Mean & SD?
smaller font?
narrower options?



-----
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Bruce Weaver
Administrator
In reply to this post by David Marso
You're on to something there, David.  

NEW FILE.
DATASET CLOSE all.
DATA LIST FREE / junk(F1).
BEGIN DATA
1
END DATA.

STRING C1(A1) C2(A2).
COMPUTE C1 = "±".
COMPUTE C2 = "±".
LIST.

OUTPUT:

junk C1 C2
 
  1     ±
 
Number of cases read:  1    Number of cases listed:  1


David Marso wrote

> Does simply making the string larger than 6 (say 10 characters) solve the
> problem?
>
>
> Maguin, Eugene wrote
>> Wow!!
>> I was making a table for another person and myself to look at and I
>> wanted
>> it to fit on a standard page in landscape. I had 11 data columns and two
>> marginal columns to show and I wanted to show SD as well to communicate
>> spread, so I needed to be compact. I'd do it differently for an article
>> and make sure the meaning is described.
>>
>> Jon, thank you. I figured that could be the problem but wasn't sure.
>> Gene Maguin
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion &lt;
>
>> SPSSX-L@.UGA
>
>> &gt; On Behalf Of Bruce Weaver
>> Sent: Friday, March 23, 2018 10:17 AM
>> To:
>
>> SPSSX-L@.UGA
>
>> Subject: Re: +/- character (±) in strings
>>
>> I'm sorry, Gene.  My question about why you want to use Mean +/- SD
>> notation may have distracted everyone from the original question.  So
>> this
>> is an effort to get things back on track.  
>>
>> My first thought was that you might be able to use the PIB format.  I
>> know
>> there are some examples in the archives of this list, but do not know if
>> any of them will be directly helpful to you.  I have a feeling there
>> could
>> be problems due to the code for +/- (177) being in the Extended ASCII
>> set.  
>>
>> https://www.petefreitag.com/cheatsheets/ascii-codes/
>>
>> David?  Andy?  Jon?  Any ideas?  
>>
>>
>>
>> Maguin, Eugene wrote
>>> Probably time to learn something new ....
>>> I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and
>>> concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the '±' character to
>>> separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and
>>> pasted it into the concantenation. For instance, Compute
>>> M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)' ±',string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6.
>>> The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is
>>> 30±1.
>>> So, it could be that inserting that '±' makes that concantenation
>>> longer than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what's the true
>>> story?
>>> Thanks, Gene Maguin
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> LISTSERV@.UGA
>>
>>>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> LISTSERV@.UGA
>
>>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage
>> subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> LISTSERV@.UGA
>
>>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
>> command. To leave the list, send the command
>> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
>> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
>> INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos
> ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in
> abyssum?"
> --
> Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
> INFO REFCARD





-----
--
Bruce Weaver
[hidden email]
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.

--
Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
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--
Bruce Weaver
bweaver@lakeheadu.ca
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
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Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Maguin, Eugene
In reply to this post by David Marso
Yes. I went from A6 to A8 and there is no truncation. Solved. Thanks all.

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion <[hidden email]> On Behalf Of David Marso
Sent: Friday, March 23, 2018 10:59 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: +/- character (±) in strings

Does simply making the string larger than 6 (say 10 characters) solve the problem?


Maguin, Eugene wrote

> Wow!!
> I was making a table for another person and myself to look at and I
> wanted it to fit on a standard page in landscape. I had 11 data
> columns and two marginal columns to show and I wanted to show SD as
> well to communicate spread, so I needed to be compact. I'd do it
> differently for an article and make sure the meaning is described.
>
> Jon, thank you. I figured that could be the problem but wasn't sure.
> Gene Maguin
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion &lt;

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> &gt; On Behalf Of Bruce Weaver
> Sent: Friday, March 23, 2018 10:17 AM
> To:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> Subject: Re: +/- character (±) in strings
>
> I'm sorry, Gene.  My question about why you want to use Mean +/- SD
> notation may have distracted everyone from the original question.  So
> this is an effort to get things back on track.
>
> My first thought was that you might be able to use the PIB format.  I
> know there are some examples in the archives of this list, but do not
> know if any of them will be directly helpful to you.  I have a feeling
> there could be problems due to the code for +/- (177) being in the Extended ASCII set.
>
> https://www.petefreitag.com/cheatsheets/ascii-codes/
>
> David?  Andy?  Jon?  Any ideas?  
>
>
>
> Maguin, Eugene wrote
>> Probably time to learn something new ....
>> I building a table of means and SDs by converting numbers to text and
>> concantenating the two substrings. I want to use the '±' character to
>> separate the mean and the SD. So I copied the character from word and
>> pasted it into the concantenation. For instance, Compute
>> M.SD=concat(string(mean.1,f3.0)' ±',string(sd,f2.0)). M.SD is A6.
>> The odd thing is that given mean = 30.23, sd = 12.345, the result is
>> 30±1.
>> So, it could be that inserting that '±' makes that concantenation
>> longer than A6 and last character is lost. Help me out, what's the
>> true story?
>> Thanks, Gene Maguin
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> LISTSERV@.UGA
>
>>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> --
> Bruce Weaver

> bweaver@

> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>
> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>
> --
> Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

>  (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD





-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in abyssum?"
--
Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD